Pages

Tuesday, May 1, 2018

Vivekananda is the vital link between Bankimchandra and Sri Aurobindo

First and foremost, we must not neglect the symbolic value of any donation: adhering to the Sri Aurobindo theater campaign (allowing for the first time in the world the representation of one of His theatrical plays), means taking part in a concrete action on the material level, at the service of the Opus. Crowdfunding for the theatre of Sri Aurobindo https://t.co/m34thVC7Ha

30th April 1908: Prafulla Chaki & Khudiram Bose threw a bomb on d carriage Magistrate Kingsford at Muzzafarpur. Bose was swiftly executed. Tilak, writing in the Kesari, defended the heroes & called for immediate Swaraj. He was convicted & sent to Mandalay https://t.co/h7WkhxPrFb
https://twitter.com/Gopanarya/status/991103561718226944?s=19

Most Indians r heart centered & all it takes is some smooth talk & clever image building. Vivekananda lamented condition of Indians when he toured India. We were & to a gr8 extent still r shrivelled shrunken embodiments of weakness & incapacity. Y Sri Aurobindo stressed SHAKTI.🙏
https://twitter.com/viryavaan/status/990984067003899909?s=19

Indian Psychology - online course starts on 2nd June 2018 - Sign up NOW (elearn@gnosticcentre.com)  https://t.co/BHiTwg374l

A few Universities run courses including IGNOU @ignouonlinehelp but Sri Aurobindo is best understood through self-study. Besides, sensitising people on respecting difference and diversity is an important task for which online acts hit the nail on the head. https://t.co/fQ544eJNOR

So Far I have explored only his ideas on nationalism, education and culture.  Can you suggest books which explains his ideas on evaluation, universalism, spirituality etc.,

[Marxists are one of many cadre based organisations that have always evaded question of caste in our society. Burying one’s head in sand and pretending that this huge social disparity doesn’t exist will not yield anything. Marxists never understood this.] https://t.co/XowIqQMY6S

The present generation should realise that it can rethink and write a new Constitution taking into consideration current realities and global imperatives. Many errors institutionalised in 1950 can be rectified and a new order in the form of Federation of India can reshape future.

Panel discussion on Protest Music dovetails into opposing political leaders and it's interesting to hear politics in Sri Aurobindo Centre itself. So politics is ubiquitous! @SACACIndia Beyond the Present @Leeterature @toxicslink @Mixtapelive https://t.co/JOzNPqlLdP

I have tended to look at Aurobindo, RL Kashyap and to an extent Vidyarthi. And Vamadeva Shastryji of course.. I spent 15 yrs acquiring a college education and now, after 30 years I realize that I will need 15 more years to master the Vedas

My work (which is ongoing) leads me to the conclusion that IVC is likely 3-5000 years AFTER Vedic culture. The details include refs to texts, paleoclimate studies and radioisotope findings of IVC region river "Saraswati

If you read Vedic scholars outside of Griffiths/Muller etc - horse and cow do not mean horse and cow literally. I suggest Aurobindo and RL Kashyap - both in English. Grifiths Muller mistranslated Sayana's work. Sayana himself had strayed off earlier works by others (Yaska IIRC)

90% of Indians who learn about Aryan "invasion"/"migration" miss the woods for the trees. They fret about the migration part which is unimportant. What led to the rewriting of our history was the claim that the language came to India from somewhere. This can be disproved -cont'd

A beautifully written piece people. Read and spread. Tears Tony Joseph a new one for detecting Y chromosome in women. And my 4 hoaxes article is part of the refs. 👍👍 https://t.co/tfWLDkNrx6

No my point is all the genetic dates may well be 100% correct. Just don't connect them up with linguistics. If you must do that - go the whole hog and look at all the linguistic evidence and do not cherry pick. This is my rebuttal - see link https://t.co/6ZOC6oeI3l

This is true in science as well - given competing hypothesis. 
Now think about it: One's "bias" is based on what one believes & belief gets pulled into what used to be science. If you "believe" AIT you will be pro-AIT because your belief, not objectivity defines your mind.

I added a video to a @YouTube playlist https://t.co/yLoidDohmX 03 Richard Hartz_AVR-SACAR_Vedanta–In the Light of Sri Aurobindo

The Historical Imperative of the Development of the World-State https://t.co/d8AlOgd5B0

@ArunudoyB This whole baul tradition of undivided bengal, in which Hindu/muslim identities never mattered,only mysticism mattered, is a syncretism of Gaudiya Bhakti Darshan with Tantric Deha Tattva, Kundalini etc. This is the beauty of bengali culture. Divergebnt streams merge here.

And you are as usual attempting to justify the hatred manufactured in the BJP-RSS ecosystem. 
It is the hatred that is the center of their politics and their attempt to homogenize. Any one who loves their culture will oppose it and that opposition can be detrimental for India

No. History of that period cannot be viewed as a battle between Hinduism and Islam. It was about Kingdoms and people.

May go through 📚 by Shyam Kumari , a very good writer from Sri Aurobindo Ashram,pondycherry,titled “How they came to Sri Aurobindo & d Mother “! She was kind enough to accept my suggestion of printing d stories in a 📖 form!
https://twitter.com/Sanjays81301051/status/990896410408116227?s=19

I feel it's difficult to turn to SA if one has already not been through a journey. I see that almost all his disciples were already into some form of spirituality when they mey him. He provides a syntheisis so tbst mind can rest and heart awakens. Maybe Mother is simpler.

Sri Aurobindo had the mettle to reduce me from a hyper-intellecualized-adwaitin-nearly-buddhist to a simple aspiring bhakta, without even meeting me. That is the thing that makes me bow down to him.

They found the new Tufail.
https://t.co/tYA7nqxGEx
https://twitter.com/wassuupp12/status/990889538435284995?s=19

Kuhn said, [science itself evolves and is far from absolute; must be understood the context in which its theories are created.] Feyerabend rejected [existence of universal methodological rules.] Randall Collins probed [intellectual networks and their inner divisions & conflicts.]

[arithmetic is far beyond all effective theories. It is important to understand that mechanism is a vaccine agents reductionism.] [Both Changeux and Connes remain still Aristotelians, but the contradiction becomes apparent as they think deep indeed.] -Bruno Marchal, Apr 17, 2018]

Gandhi had  said correctly or incorrectly that Hindus are cowards. They easily get bullied. Hindu BJP politicians in power are worse, get bullied more easily. Gandhi though never saw Hindu BJP politicians in power!

Don't add me to a Hindutva group; I am a Hindu, not comfortable in the company of Hindus who do not or cannot go a step further than slogans and posters. Don't add me to a liberal group; I am not... https://t.co/K1123wKFfx

The beauty of a free market lies not in its morality but in the fact that it provides an equal opportunity to all, sellers and buyers alike, to be immoral. However, what is immoral is a grey area, too: not... https://t.co/DEhoubrf6P

अछूत जातियों का निर्माण 1911 में अंग्रेजों ने किस प्रकार किया सच्चाई का खुलासा ध्यान से पढ़ें https://t.co/WhtILmdktF

"खुद को दलित कहना आत्महत्या के समान है"
जिन सरकारी संस्थानों स्मारकों व पार्कों के नाम में दलित शब्द जुड़ा है बेहद दुर्भाग्यपूर्ण लज्जाजनक व शर्मनाक है इससे भारत की छवि बिगड़ती है इसको तुरंत हटाया जाए। https://t.co/IAMW26Oafd
https://twitter.com/shantprakash/status/990559672057839616?s=19

'This is really dangerous situation,' says BJP MP Udit Raj on mass conversion of Dalits to Buddhism https://t.co/Rp1E01D7hg

Two articles, one by @arvindneela (https://t.co/ooVVqjGRqo) and another by @aalokelab (https://t.co/pZMoIGjBgL), that must be read. Right now. TOTAL annihilation of the nonsensical and grotesque piece so enthusiastically peddled by the Print recently.

The Divine Mother, or as she is known more widely, the Mother of Sri Aurobindo Ashram: https://t.co/DGSsHuVmeH

India Should Reclaim Buddha's Philosophy and Vipassana to Build Soft Power https://t.co/xlVbqHHFTO via @thewire_in

Eight Facts Communists Hide About Marx. Here are 8 facts you should know about the man who undeniably made a great dent in human history.  https://t.co/gQ3UvOzORA via @swarajyamag

An Indic Renaissance Is Far From Complete - Swarajya

https://swarajyamag.com/magazine/an-indic-renaissance-is-far-from-complete
11 hours ago - In a fascinating document called Bhawani Mandir, that Sri Aurobindowrote in Baroda in 1905, we can glean clues of what we need to do, not only to regain our lost heritage, but how to build a more glorious future. Citing Japan's example, Aurobindo tells us that our best opportunity lies in revitalisation of our ancient spiritual ...
We must not forget that it is Swamiji who is the vital link between Bankimchandra Chattopadhyay, the poet of Vande Mataram, and Aurobindo. Vivekananda, thus, is the key to the process of India’s reawakening. - Makarand Paranjape

 

Sonia Gandhi to Sooni Tata, Mother Teresa, a new book examines the ...

Firstpost-27-Apr-2018
Even a woman like Mirra Alfassa — who helped found the Sri Aurobindo Ashram and Auroville township, and stayed in (then) Pondicherry from the 1970s, travelled the world. She went to Japan, North Africa... Travel imparted the mental flexibility needed to perform with poise the identity acrobatics demanded of the Indian ...

Interpreting Hegel's India

Economic and Political Weekly-19-Apr-2018
This would require some amount of rigorous substantiation through a reading of Hegel and the Gita, but rather what is to be found are references to the works of Vishwanath Prasad Varma's The Political Philosophy of Sri Aurobindo (which can hardly be considered to possess a rigorous discussion of Hegel's politico-ethical ...

Things to do in Mumbai today

Mumbai Mirror-17-Apr-2018
He teaches Integral Psychology at the Sri Aurobindo International Centre of Education in Pondicherry, and is the director of the Indian Psychology Institute. At this session, he will focus on Sri Aurobindo's Vedic understanding of reality as an evolving manifestation of consciousness, which provides a perspective on the future ...

Madurai Today

The Hindu-28-Apr-2018
Sri Aurobindo Study Forum: Discourse on Sri Aurobindo's 'Life Divine' by Subramany, Auro Lab, Veerapanjan, 10 a.m.

[PDF] The History and Patterns of Education, Evolution of Schools and the Role Played by the Educational Institutions in India - S Karnel
… expanded and by which one can stand on one's own feet”. Sri Aurobindo viewede education as, “helping the growing soul draw out that is in itself.” According to Rabindranath Tagore, “Education is that which makes one's life …
...

Hi Avtar, thats a very interesting view and surely needs serious consideration! We should perhaps think of consciousness, matter and energy as different phases of the same primordial entity. Consciousness is like gas, energy is like liquid and matter is like solid.

Best,
Kushal.

On Sun, Apr 29, 2018 at 9:33 PM, 'Asingh2384' via Sadhu-Sanga Under the holy association of Spd. B.M. Puri Maharaja, Ph.D. wrote:
Just as at the critical point state, solid, liquid, and vapor states are no longer distinguishable, at the Zero Point State of the universe mass/energy/space/time (physicality or non-physicality, zero or inifinity or any numbers) are no longer separable and exist as a wholesome entity which is eternal, omnipresent, and all-inclusive reality of the implicate order of the universal laws or cosmic consciousness.
 Best Regards
Avtar 


My article in Times of India regarding Swarna Bharat Party, India’s only liberal party https://t.co/F64uWf8DET

People of India are too tolerant; we need to have a peaceful movement with civil society playing large role to awaken & churn the Politicians bureaucrat nexus. Unfortunately AAP has failed. Still no leader in sight. Droves of intelligent leaving country won't help
https://twitter.com/MistSunny/status/966904420691668993?s=19

My email to Sagarika Ghose about the meaning of liberalism https://t.co/IuZBiJoDgw #swarnabharatparty

Liberalism in #India – a reading list https://t.co/NiS8NRKAHx #liberty
S.P. Aiyar wrote perhaps the best article on Indian liberalism that I’m aware of: The Concept of Liberalism and its Relevance for India (I published it online at the India Policy Institute around 20 years ago).
But there are many other readings worth looking through. I’m listing a few of these – in no particular order:
Whiggism in India by GANESH PRASHAD Banaras Hindu University, published in Political Science Quarterly, Vol. 81, No. 3 (Sep., 1966), pp. 412-431. Word version.
Liberalism in India by Manish, G. P.; Rajagopalan, Shruti; Sutter, Daniel; White, Lawrence H., Econ Journal Watch . Sep2015, Vol. 12 Issue 3, p432-459. 28p. Word version.   (I take a particularly dim view about this article – very poor scholarship).
SANJAY SONAWANI’S WORK
After 20 years of failure to make any dent on Indians’ psyche with the message of liberty and good governance – so deeply immersed their mind is in their narrow identities of caste, religion or region – I’ve come to the (reluctant) view that we need to strengthen the nationalist focus of our liberal message.
Liberalism and nationalism are often at logger heads. Potentially, these two ideas are irreconcilable.
But the practical reality is that Indians, in particular, are perhaps the most collectivist group of people in the world. They do not easily seem themselves as individuals first and foremost. Their identifies are completely subsumed by some ethnic, regional or religious category.
So, I’ve come to the view that we should mix the least dangerous of collectivisms with the message of liberty. The least dangerous is perhaps nationalism, although that can deteriorate into fascism if it is allowed to further mix with religion.
The best collectivism is America’s pride in being “the land of opportunity”. The statue of liberty represents this idea of a nation whose sole purpose is to defend liberty.
So if we shift SBP’s message towards this – India as a great melting pot, the goal of becoming the greatest land of opportunity – then we could hopefully avoid the dangerous elements of nationalism and awaken the sleeping Indians who are slipping far behind the leading nations of the world.
I am proposing (this needs to be tested on the ground) that we start with a collectivist ultra-nationalist message that rejects small thinkers (those who focus on caste/religion/region). Then we move to “sarkar hamari naukar hai” type messages.

Marketime: Patterns of the Present and Beyond the Present #SriAurobindo @SACACIndia @desharbendu @toxicslink @Mixtapelive @Bongchild https://t.co/YYXIqnZQMk https://t.co/J9shZTrALu

Savitri Era Learning Forum (SELF - since 2005): Gnostic Centre, Savitri Bhavan, SACAR, SAFIC, and Esalen courses https://t.co/PTPfebIN22 #SriAurobindo #MirraAlfassa #FiveDreams #WorldUnion #SavitriEraParty @NathTusar SRA-102-C, Shipra Riviera, Indirapuram, Ghaziabad - 201014 (UP)

Savitri Era: The Mother & Sri Aurobindo signify Evolution and Revolution https://t.co/xEqTal8xQi #SriAurobindo #MirraAlfassa #FiveDreams #WorldUnion #SavitriEraParty @NathTusar Savitri Era Learning Forum (SELF) SRA-102-C, Shipra Riviera, Indirapuram, Ghaziabad - 201014 (UP) India

Since its inception in 2007 (Centenary year of Surat split), Savitri Era Party (SEP) has been busy in expanding scope of practical action in the light of The Mother & Sri Aurobindo's thought. Their works belong to a certain time period; so conceiving future policies is necessary.

Indians love being under some big authority; the legacy of long years of Monarchy and Colonial rule is yet to dissipate. Savitri Era Party (SEP) advocates Freedom and supports Market so that people imbibe courage to think freely and act according to their free choice. #FiveDreams

[When Bipin Chandra Pal was speaking of China and Japan overthrowing European civilisation, how many understood or appreciated great issues? We have lost the faculty of great ideas, outlooks, which divines the great motions of the world.] Sri Aurobindo BANDE MATARAM April 1, 1908

Any one learning music or dance revers a Guru which itself is of religious nature and akin to believing in God. https://t.co/O4Tc9Q9Yjf

There are innumerable taxonomies but the one that's fundamental to Sri Aurobindo's explanation on the significance of Castes derives from his unique psychological interpretation of Vedic Deities: Knowledge, Power, Harmony, and Work are the four essential domains within a society.

Material progress and consequent pleasure seeking has affected human nature and so, it won't be correct to lay the blame at the door of the West alone. Story of human civilisation has to be seen as a whole instead of creating false binaries and imagining an Indian exceptionalism.

Opacity or liminality are far more preferable to simplifying complex scenarios. To quote Isaiah Berlin (6 June 1909 – 5 November1997), [To confuse our own constructions and inventions with eternal laws or divine decrees is one of the most fatal delusions of men. (1974)] #EHCarr

[Writing the village, becoming the nation: The work of Manoj Das. M Ratti - The Journal of Commonwealth Literature, 2018. Manoj Das is a leading senior writer within Indian literature, with his novels, short stories,
and poems centring on village and rural life, mingling realism]

Exquisitely written. Reading it just made my day. https://t.co/Lat6gDNa9R

A good overview of Shakespeare and Odia literature through comparison of Dr Mansingh's work and another translation of Hamelt in 1934 by A K Bandopadhyay https://t.co/tkx2Gtk9bm

Heard this Odia song and realized that languages in the East are quite similar. Maithili, Bangla, Odia, Assamese are so close that a native speaker of one can get about 90% of the other with no prior training and some concentration: https://t.co/ey1ONh8Q01

[Relics installation day, Wednesday, Apr 18, 2018: Sri Aurobindo Adhyayana Kendra, Rajgangpur (Odisha) and Matrubihar, Sundargarh (Odisha) installed by Sri Champaklalji in 1984. Sri Aurobindo's Relics has come to Odisha fifteen times to sixty-five places.] https://t.co/Y4L4ULsjWK

Friday, December 8, 2017

With the Mother, Sri Aurobindo ushered in modern Hinduism

Assorted tweets:

MN
Sri Aurobindo had a strong non-denominational spirituality. He was not parochial. He did not confuse culture with spirituality. With the Mother, he ushered in modern Hinduism. Beyond the Vedas,  with his own meditative insights https://t.co/sCN0VEh2Lx

MN
Something gleaned beyond the books to develop and evolve and where necessary, reject the body of knowledge (from the Vedas).

GN
What has Sri Aurobindo ‘rejected’ from the Vedas? And if it indeed knowledge then it must be an expression of some truth. How do you reject ‘knowledge’ then if it stands on its own & needs no acceptance or rejection to exist?

MN
Knowledge is not permanent. Some Vedic practices are outdated.  Sri Aurobindo's thoughts focused not on rituals.  I had only used the term "beyond" that includes implicit rejection of some rituals. See this for sample of the outmoded kind. 

GN
So really Sri Aurobindo has not rejected anything from the vedas. He has in fact elucidated their inner occult meaning. To see this as a rejection of vedic sacrifices, which the mantra-drashtras of the Vedas themselves engaged in, is a projection of the modern westernized mindset

MN
Evolution involves leaving outmoded things behind. Whether we call it rejection or not is just a matter of semantics

GN
Just because humans evolved would u say that all the other millions of forms of life are outmoded? Perhaps we are advanced in some very important ways but surely evolution of something new does not necessarily imply outright rejection or negation of what preceded it.

MN
Absolutely, but my understanding is of Sri Aurobindo involves an evolution that is "supramental' in which some other forms are laggards, and in that sense, outmoded. The idea is to locate nobler thoughts and go with them.

GN
But let us at least first grapple with the mental before venturing towards the supramental. The very Vedic truths & forms we want to reject are declared by Sri Aurobindo himself to have been revealed from higher than mental standpoint. Y to reject them from our mental standpoint?

MN
I do believe "consciousness" is key. Rest falls in place. "Ordered intution" of the kind Sri Aurobindo spoke of may show the way. "Rejection" is not blind but based on an inner sense of clarity. Or should be. Have a nice day!

WL
But he as clear that all His new findings were following the Leonine spirit of the Gita n RG Veda which was left unfinished in the past by rishis then and said more will come in future thus making s.dharma an infinite strong treasure of God
so Sri Aurobindo reaffirmed hinduism was actually most the LIFE TRANSFORMING as opposed to life weakening mayavada budhistic jainism that had gripped it's ppl. So He was not beyond the Vedas so as to divorce Him from sanatana dharma.
In fact that Sri Aurobindo found the root of His Savitri in the RgVeda and spoke contrary to trad Hindus extolling Upanishads as 'refined n essence of veda'. Rgveda alone, he said  speaks of heavenly waters drenching the earth as divinisation of matter flash/earth.

TNM
Sri Aurobindo has been excluded from the Hindu list and it seems to be quite appropriate. His integral approach has that subversive element which no past religion or ideology would accommodate. Even, his eulogy of English poets contains severe strictures. https://t.co/42CC6pHKSK - https://t.co/lJyaWRNeSG
Like it or not, Sri Aurobindo is opposed to all dominant narratives, - what postmodernism ushered in much later - so much so, all his philosophical expositions fail to construct any fixed Ontology. Evolution, and not some specific culture or tradition, is the crux of his teaching.
Castigating Congress or the Marxist historians might be valid on many counts but religious sentiments are not the right ingredient for erecting an ethical bulwark for justifying the demolition of a medieval monument that deserved preservation by a modern and democratic nation.
Local and social problems abound India and ceding them to political parties for solving hardly succeeds. Formal social organisations needed with statutory backing for taking up issues facilitating negotiation and conflict resolution.
Looking beyond ordinary circumstances is the first lesson from Sri Aurobindo. Aspiring for a better state of affairs is the second. That present imperfections can be remedied through Evolution is the next. And the last is collaborating with that process by being a humble student.
Reading "The Secret of the Veda" by Sri Aurobindo transforms your worldview in the sense that common terms and names unveil fresh meanings. For instance, [the word ghrta is constantly used in connection with the thought or the mind, that heaven in the Veda is symbol of the mind.]

Feel Philosophy: Their concerns are complimentary, and a dialog between these thinkers is urgently required - At the ends of man: Sri Aurobindo and Michel Foucault by Rich

GN
But wud Einstein be excluded from the tradition or lists of the knowledge tradition of physics just because his revelations were ‘subversive’ of the prior Newtonian model? Hinduism sets no bar on new truths at different times or varying truths in different places at the same time
https://twitter.com/viryavaan/status/939145358504087554
That is why the most primitive animism co-exists along with the most sophisticated philosophies within Hinduism. If subversiveness were a bar to inclusion then the first thing that must be thrown out is the most popular & universally revered Hindu scripture, Sri Krishna’s Gita.

D
Thank you! People don't need to read Vedas, Upanishads or even Hindu history to know Hinduism if they read the writings and works of these three alone. Everything that one will ever need to know about the religion and the culture is in these writings.
https://twitter.com/desibrah/status/938219594791002112

S
Sorry, I don't agree there. People should independently read the Upanishads & Vedas to form their own opinions. The opinions of Swami Dayananda Saraswati, Savarkar & Vivekananda are, however, highly valuable to any Hindu & particularly, those reading Vedas & Upanishads.
https://twitter.com/maidros78/status/938224116527611904
Very true. Savarkar, Dayananda Saraswati, Vivekananda, even the Brahmo reformists are very very useful & motivators for learning more. But it is still their opinion of the Vedas/Upanishads, not the Vedas/Upanishads themselves.

HG
My views on Hindutva are more nuanced now. The state-society distinction remains material, and so is the terminology. But having studied history, philosophy and religion further- I believe that India should be declared a Dharma Rashtra. My piece (Jan 2012) https://t.co/TP3qwq2VHz
https://twitter.com/harshmadhusudan/status/938858465434288128

M
Indian constitution treats citizens based on their religion. Why are people then demanding that religion and politics not be mixed?  https://t.co/3T9OyvuCBb
https://twitter.com/myindmakers/status/938991684179836934

Wednesday, June 21, 2017

We are not interested in reading Sri Aurobindo

Bhakti Madhava Puri
Dear Panchan Pramanik,
My response:

No philosopher in his right mind would deny the existence of the material world, although there are some misguided ones who would try to convince others that it is all an illusion. We are certainly not denying the existence of the material world. And the scriptures do not deny its existence either.

If you have a material conception of reality, you can see only matter. Then what about those who have a spiritual conception of reality? What do they see? Just as the materialist sees matter, the spiritually awakened soul sees God. There is no difficulty for the devotee to see his Lord everywhere. As it is described in the scriptures:  “atmavan manyate jagat” - as you are, so you see the world. As the supreme Lord Krishna states in the Gita, “bhaktya mam abhijananti” – “I can be known by devotion.” Thus there is no problem in seeing God for one who is properly qualified and purified of the material conception of life.

Aurobindo and Vivekananda may not be Unicorns, but they are certainly Monists – reducing everything to one, like the single horn of the unicorn. We reject the monist viewpoint of reality as abstractly one-sided. Rather, we find the teachings of Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu to be more rational. He taught the principle of “achintya bedha bedha tattva” - difference and non-difference together. Monist philosophers are under a misconception, for they cannot explain how differentiated personalities and varieties come from non-differentiated impersonal substance.

We are not interested in reading Aurobindo and Vivekananda. If you want to present a particular viewpoint of theirs we are interested in arguing their ideas. In fact, we find their message to be fundamentally lacking in proper understanding and substance. Since this list is dedicated to discussion of the relation of science to religion, unless you have a specific point in reference to a philosopher or rishi, general prosylitizing of sectarian preferences will not be posted here to avoid divergence from our main topic of concern. I have already mentioned in this post, that if the aforementioned gentlemen accept the theory of evolution then we are showing that they, along with materialistic scientists, are misguided in their understanding of scientific evidence, scriptural conclusions and ontological reality.

Finally, your claim that "religion was always against science" shows a complete lack of any understanding of what has transpired in this list, and a complete lack of knowledge of the history of science, or of the Vedas. If this is what you have to show for your enlightenment by Aurobindo and Vivekananda, then you show them to be extremely poor teachers. 

Re: Reality: Is it Personal or Impersonal or both?
Dear Panchan Pramanik, You sent this list an interesting challenge to some of the points in my post on the above mentioned topic in the subject line.
07/02/2010 by Bhakti Madhava Puri - 2 posts - 1 authors

You agree with Dr Shanta that cells are conscious.
[By the way I have heard that Shri Aurobindo and Mother did a lot of work on the consciousness of cells. This was way before the present discussions started. I wonder why their work is not mentioned so far. Shri Aurobindo was a also  'PRAKHAR' Vedanti.]
I wonder if you also agree with Dr Shanta when he says with great confidence that the knowledge of Biology accumulated over the last hundred or more years should be thrown into the dust bin?
I wonder if the discovery of the structure of DNA and its replication, followed by the formulation of 'CENTRAL DOGMA' move Biology forward or backward. 
I wonder if the limitations of CENTRAL DOGMA itself could have been meaningfully discovered without the help of that DOGMA?
 
I have no difficulty in thinking that cells are conscious.
I am curious to know how this 'fact' affects the way Biology research is or will be or should be carried out. As far as i am aware, experimental procedures that suggest that cells behave as if they are conscious are no different from the ones that are done to determine their other properties.
In physics, the arrivals of RELATIVITY and even QUANTUM MECHANICS have not led any one to suggest that NEWTON should be thrown into dust bin.
I was puzzled by your last comment that seemed to say that you as a chemist, do not think that QM is necessary for understanding protein chemistry! I must have missed something because, as you must know, QM seems to pervade chemistry more intimately than consciousness.
I have no expertise in any field under discussion. 
The questions I am asking arise from reading the interesting mails 
regards,
kumar bhatt 

Digest of emails received between June 1 to June 8, 2016.
Dear Friends, A digest of emails received between June 1 to June 8, 2016 is being appended herewith. Thanking you, Bhaktivijnana Muni ...
09/06/2016 by Bhakti Vijnana Muni, PhD - 1 posts - 1 authors

RE: [Sadhu Sanga] Paper Refuting Darwinism Published in Journal ' Communicative & Integrative Biology'
Dear Colleagues,I quite agree with Prof. Hanin and also others view that Darwinism does,nt have any scientific basis.It is based only on hypothetical ...
23/10/2015 by krishnamisra - 144 posts - 50 authors

Don Salmon
I just looked up Rosen's book. The first reviewer almost has it: "Physics has little to say about life.'

More accurate: "physics has nothing to say about life"  in fact, physics has nothing to say about matter - it only can measure an abstraction from our sensory experience (eddington knew this quite well - all they have are "pointer readings" - Whitehead said it more poetically, "Apart from experience there is nothingness, bare nothingness"

Quantum coherence is hardly more than a conclusion based on measurements about processes of something of which modern scientists from physicists to those in my field, psychology, have absolutely no knowledge.  None. Zero. 

That is, as scientists (of the quantitative kind) they have no knowledge.  If the scientists' knowledge were all we had of the universe, the universe would not exist.

As sentient beings, of course they have Knowledge. The big problem is they don't know it. 

On Mon, Oct 19, 2015 at 7:59 PM, Don Salmon <donsa...@gmail.com> wrote:
quantum coherence?  = life?  I don't think so!

If you take away the material universe, you still have Life, but no matter, and I wouldn't imagine that the subtle planes worry much about physicists' quantum imaginings!

But we can meet tonight in a lucid dream and check it out. 

Re: [Sadhu Sanga]
Srinavasa,. What you say seems plausible. Knowing one's limitations is the key. In the history of philosophy we see this emphasized by Socrates, Plato ...
24 May by pjetli - 15 posts - 9 authors

pjetli
Srinavasa,

What you say seems plausible. Knowing one's limitations is the key. In the history of philosophy we see this emphasized by Socrates, Plato and Kant among others. However, most of the discussion in this forum is about going beyond the limit of human knowledge and big claims are made about the existence of God and consciousness and their causal role. This is what Kant would call dielectic illusion, that is claims to knowledge of something that is beyond the abilities of humans to know. To justify such knowledge the only recourse is to appeal to some sort of divine interference. And it always amuses me how we know that God made humans superior so that only they can know this, yet every life form is necessary for the survival of the planet. In any case I see a paradox that even you might have to face. If you are going to claim that there is a God and this God is the final cause of everything or that there is a universal consciousness and it is supervenient over the physical, then how do we acquire knowledge of this since it is beyond the capacity of humans to know this as we hear repeatedly. 

Priyedarshi
Don Salmon
Dr. Rao:  You may wish to look at Christof Koch's ideas on panpsychism (consciousness as universal, pervading the universe).  Whether or not you agree, at least now, with one of the world's leading scientists on board, one cannot dismiss outright the possibility of consciousness being, as Sri Aurobindo wrote, "the fundamental thing in the universe."


On Tue, May 23, 2017 at 7:46 AM, Srinivasa Rao Kankipati <ksra...@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear Mr Vasavada, I went through your reply to Mr Bob and find it very fresh and interesting. I like your bottom-up approach rather than the top-down one. But I would like to hear your own interpretation of what "consciousness' is. Then we can settle whether it is so universal as you hypothesise. According to our ordinary understanding of consciousness, matter is abundant in the universe, life is not so abundant but still plenty, and consciousness is a faculty available in living beings in a minuscule percentage and seems to be somewhat developed in humans. Matter is a necessary condition for life but not sufficient, and life is a necessary condition for consciousness  but not sufficient. For Vedantists to talk of universality of consciousness is a big flight of their own consciousness, but not true, I think.
- Dr K Srinivasa Rao, Hyderabad, camp Cupertino. 

Re: [Sadhu Sanga] Platonic Idea of the Good.
Bruno, Again, thanks for your detailed response. I agree with you on truth. I think the truth condition should actually be dropped and could be replaced ...
27 Apr by pjetli - 24 posts - 8 authors

RE: [Sadhu Sanga] back to Thomas Nagel, "Why the Materialist Neo-Darwinian Conception of Nature Is Almost Certainly False" (2012)
" Hegel put himself outside this tradition." A recent book, "Hegel's India" brings into focus his tryst with Indian philosophy giving rise to the speculation ...
16 Apr by me - 392 posts - 54 authors
Re: [Sadhu Sanga] Response to your question on Bohm's theory.
Thanks Bruno for appreciation and positive assessment. You have raised enough anticipation in this forum about your theory which, let's hope, will be ...
29 May by me - 57 posts - 19 authors
Re: [Sadhu Sanga] What is Hawking's Mind of God?
An apposite connection to Whitehead, Tusar. In fact, the central content of the essay you link, along with the quote from Wittgenstein, has been ...
15 Jun by chris - 78 posts - 20 authors
RE: Sadhu Sanga forum.
Dear Tushar,. Thanks for your e-mail. I have very high respect but very limited knowledge about Sri Aurobindo. Last year on our trip to south India we ...
29 May by vasavada - 8 posts - 6 authors
Re: [Sadhu Sanga] Advaita, Consciousness and Quantum Physics.
Dear Tusar, On 07 Jun 2017, at 18:33, Tusar Nath Mohapatra wrote: Thanks for your considered reply. It appears that what I am asking for coincides ...
9 Jun by marchal - 47 posts - 14 authors
Tushar and others RE: [Sadhu Sanga] cosmic mind.
I agree. There is no scientific definition of cosmic mind, Tao or Brahman. In fact Rishis describe Brahman as “Neti Neti' ( Not this, Not this)!
13 Jun by vasavada - 6 posts - 5 authors
Re: [Sadhu Sanga] Re: Consciousness and matter.
The metaphysical basis for Integral Health — the nature of reality Dr. Soumitra Basu [In Chapter V of The Life Divine, Sri Aurobindo introduces a ...
25 Apr by me - 46 posts - 14 authors
Events and announcements.
Seven Day ICPR Workshop on Studies in Consciousness in the Light of Sri Aurobindo's Philosophy (With special Emphasis on the Upanishads) 19th ...
9 Jun by me - 3 posts - 2 authors
Re: [Sadhu Sanga] Physics and qualiap.
Dear Jo,. Today, I read some pages from your book via Google Books and found it quite interesting. The fact that you have been able to formulate such ...
16 Jun by me - 1 posts - 1 authors


Sunday, May 21, 2017

My twelve years with social media

You didn't quote Vedic verses to support your view as I asked. Believing without understanding is your problem. It's not personal attack.
Not predicting anything, expressing my views. Believing in something because its written by someone without understanding is your problem.
Please keep Vedas out of politics & politics out of Sanatana Dharma. Best way to destroy HINDUISM is to mix it with politics, it's TOXIC.
If you are not accountable to what you say then your words are hollow and you are just disgracing great souls like Sri Aurobindo
In Aurobindo's philosophies, critical thinking is must for thriving society. But if it irritates you so much, may be you are a faker
My twelve years with social media has revolved around a single theme and it's Sri Aurobindo. My belief/views are free as I'm not accountable
I said, I will not write catering to your demand but I'm certainly accountable to what I tweet or write at my blog. https://t.co/XEx44QYmDc
Seems so, but I'm typing out this tweet on my Micromax tablet while I used to doodle on a similar looking chalkboard slate, sixty years back
@SangeetaRG Do you know @SavitriEraParty  ? Since both of you love Sri Aurobindo, I asked.
Through social networks only :)
https://twitter.com/SangeetaRG/status/864158433792016384

Aurobindo & Mother never started or encouraged any religion.If this guy wants to start a religion let him do so based on his original work. https://t.co/Ecc25FoaEG
Another "Dukandar" of religion. Its just a business for these brainless dimwits.
@VHPsampark @RSSorg @BJP4India @Swamy39 
So all hindus are following meaningless rituals!!! 
Ban such organizations,they are spreading venom https://t.co/YifqPodKGg
@AshuSengh this is what i was telling you. That's the agenda funded by west and many NGO's. U asked 4 reading material, here it is.

*uncle ki jali*😂😂😂 https://t.co/CTTvF62HjD
*ye beed humka de de thakur* https://t.co/6TdcVPakSi
Old fart seems to be failed naxalbari product of 1960's still living out his fantasies of revolution even as he is approaching senility

i hv read sri aurobindo in original, not all of his works, but one or two of them, like synthesis of yoga. i hv deepest regards for him also. https://t.co/egrVRP90f8
even i am not arguing with u in any way whatsoever,i guess both of us are grown up enough to discuss and differ without arguments. https://t.co/fns1vnUshl

you are stretching the argument too far. Templ = abode of Gods. Mosque= where namaz is offered. It is not a place where God resides. Simple.
I am on that path. No need for a suggestion from you. Who has entrusted you the job to suggest or guide me?

One nutcase here presumes to know the future through his spiritual travels,advises people to ignore history and go by his crazy predictions
This happens when you are into drugs like liberalism. It makes you believe you are the messiah of the world and have the right to tell... ...the world how it should live.
At least this person is honest & openly asks for dissolution of India. Unlike some who hide behind hyperbole of imaginary grievances.
why right now @SavitriEraParty  here IMPOSING it as 'inmost feelings of EVERY Indian', suppressing our thoughts of respectful coexistance?
Well he lives in some cult type fantasy.
World forum & such hypothetical nonsense. 
Ignores ground realities.

Sane advice, save for one tiny detail. The luxury of not bothering about others does not exist in this world. They're bothered about us...
There is NO such thing as a world forum that's going to decide matters. Just some fuddy-duddy liberal nonsense.
A naive pipe dream, nothing more. The UN is nothing but a playground of the rich and powerful. No one cares for the squabbling. Even the...  ...underwritten by some other bigger power, or has to live under the shadow of one.
World union is a kid dream. And so is 50 Indias or 100 Indias or whatever.
Nothing but the pipe dream of the naive. Will never happen, rest assured. Liberals can keep dreaming, though. Ain't no law against that.

This Tusar Sir who calls himself Disciple of Sri Aurobindo & The Mother BUT calling for India's Balkanization is actually INSULTING them.
Sir, its Unfortunate U call urself Sri Aurobindo's disciple & want "Balkanization" of India! what was The Mother's view on India's partition?
The point is India may be a nation state for last 70 years, but it has been a nation for many millennia. Todays boundaries are artificial.
tyranny !! tyranny is where there is no multiplicity. multiple govts into a union but no to dual, twin, is from slavery to individualism.
OK Sir. Can you share some research paper or Books to back up these claims of benefits due to dissolution of India.

You mean Art 370 should be applied throughout India.
Well that is a revolutionary idea! It will solve many problems.
This, sir, is a huge mental block most Indians will have to overcome in order to understand our argument. https://t.co/udSY54yhUd
Abolishing the central govt. is a plank that I would wholeheartedly support... regardless of my aversion towards democracy. 
Thread inside... https://t.co/xuZQ0GlSSk

Entire thread is too intellectual. Have read a little, all that was brought to purview while in Yoga...
Sri Aurobindo's life gave me inspiration. I had seen politics closely. Now or in near future we donot find ethics in politics b. of corruption
In Indian society caste, religion and corruption plays important role. As long as we have reservations we do not see ethics in the society
Not the fault of Savarkar et al when confused followers cant choose between Dharmic and political battles. But I am optimistic. https://t.co/IyRIhfm3ge

Hindutva has no use for Sri Aurobindo's Secret of the Veda - Tweets by @SavitriEraParty Savitri Era: Cling to Sri Aurobindo's Vedic rediscovery - Tusar Nath Mohapatra, Director, Savitri Era Learning Forum https://t.co...
My twelve years with social media - You didn't quote Vedic verses to support your view as I asked. Believing without understanding is your problem. It's not personal attack. https://twitter.co...
Karma and popular imagination of it are universes apart - Dear Jonathan I think the claim that qualia are no different from electromagnetic fields and gravity follows logically from the view that qualia have a cau...
Savitri Era Party has prevented Hindutva from appropriating Sri Aurobindo - Savitri Era Learning Forum Natural world doesn't entirely obey computable physics - Tusar, I am not sure from which authority you are able to say that these...
States must get Sovereignty and UN membership - Tusar Nath Mohapatra · @TusarSir [In our psychological interpretation of the Veda we are met at every turn by the ancient conception of the Truth as the pat...
Babaji, Prapatti and Utsabananda Samantaray - Sri Aurobindo Ashram Pondicherry, 12.02.1950 To, Sj Lalit Mohan Ghose, The purpose of your letter was communicated to Sri Aurobindo and The Mother. They gi...
-